Statement by Minister Angie Motshekga
Questions and answers
Minister Aaron Motsoaledi (speaking off the statement):
Ladies and gentlemen before I finish I just want to touch on something that we believe is a matter of public interest. In the past few days there has been lots of media and public hysteria about the issue of doctors who are not qualified who have been caught to be practising in South Africa. Because investigations are going on about this issue I would like to chose one particular case on which there has been a lot of public comment. The issue of one of the doctors who is employed in the Eastern Cape Department of Health. I still don't know where all this hysteria came from because everybody believes that we are in the process of endangering the lives of our people by hiring unqualified doctors.
I was shocked when I heard the news because I didn't understand how this could happen. This is Dr Cheke Valentine Izulu (sick) from Nigeria. I am not his shop steward, I am not his lawyer, I just want to state the facts as we know them and the rest will be determined by the court of law.
Dr Izulu qualified as a doctor in Nigeria in November 2003. He registered with the Medical and Dental Council of Nigeria on 28 November 2003. He passed the Board Examination in South Africa with the Health Professions Council and registered with them on the 5 May 2010. His registration number is MP0688916 with the Health Professions Council of South Africa.
The doctor was employed by the Eastern Cape Department of Health on May 2010. At the time of employment the Eastern Cape Department of Health verified with theHealth Professions Council of South Africa and the staff collected the verifications certificates. Further than that the Eastern Cape Department after the press releases last year confirmed with the Nigerian Embassy the validity of the doctor and the Nigerian Embassy validated that he is a qualified doctor. The Eastern Cape department also phoned and confirmed with the Medical and Dental Council of Nigeria about the registration of the doctor and this was confirmed.
The department also again asked the Health Professions Council to send them a copy of his registration which I have got here in front of me. I also have the certificate of authority from the Council of the University of Nigeria about the qualification of this doctor.
Now ladies and gentlemen if doctors do malpractice, if he has done any malpractice he must be punished by the Health Professions Council like any malpractice case that is what I want to emphasise. What are The Hawks investigating, what The Hawks are investigating are not the qualification of the doctor, its a case of fraud because this doctor, before he got his documents ready one doctor hired him in private practice to do a local for him, that is fraudulent because his certificates were not yet ready in South Africa, that is what The Hawks are investigating.
Secondly they are investigating the possibility of him being in South Africa illegally, those are the cases they are doing. But about the fact whether this man is a doctor or not, the information at our disposal, unless the Embassy has lied to us, unless the Nigerian University has lied, unless the Health Professions Council in Nigeria has lied. But I want to stand on one thing nobody will pass the Bar Examination in South Africa if he is not a doctor. Last month I was questioned very brutally by the media about doctors, who believe our board exams are too difficult to pass, they said so. I had to have professors verifying that every doctor in South Africa must pass the board exams, they were saying they are difficult, you can’t work in South Africa.
Now all of the sudden here is a man who has passed them and he is not supposed to be a doctor, I don't understand how it happens. The second thing I have worked in a hospital ladies and gentlemen, doctors do cheat, not doctors, quaks. They are there in private practice, there are many people who pretend to be doctors and they survive. In the hospital you will never survive we will catch you the first day, I know it from experience. I had a doctor from Holland in a hospital who came straight from Holland and pretended to be a doctor, he was caught by the nurse on the very first day. In hospital you can’t, you can do it in your private practice somewhere, in our hospitals it will be difficult, even nurses will catch you.
It will immediately become evident that you have never practised and so I my first question on this issue was where are the nurses and doctors in this hospital in the Eastern Cape? Because if the government had made a mistake they would have known on the first day. Because they will know there is no thug who is perfect when it comes to pretending to be a doctor. You can do that pretence in private practice, in our hospitals I am repeating it, come and try it we will know it the very first day. The question is what will we do about it.
So I just want to allay the public that these types of thing that has been reported and cannot very easily happen. That doctor who was caught by a nurse she told me that I am not a trained doctor but what this person is prescribing I don't believe in it. She went to hide the patients because I was not there and brought the charge to me. I read the first file of the patient and without investigating I knew this man is not trained just by reading what he has written there.
So the public must rest assured that contrary to believe it’s not very easy. It will be easy in private practice, it will never be easy in the private hospital because there you will be forced to invade the patients and it will become very evident. So I am sure this matter will be laid to rest until The Hawks investigate the case of fraud. But those families who believe that doctor did anything to their families that is malpractice and I cant defend that, the Health Professions Council will have to investigate.
Questions and answers
Deidre starts
Questions and answers
Journalist: Minister Motsoaledi could you please just provide a little more detail on the process around NHI. You mentioned that the Inter-Ministerial Committee has approved the policy document does it still need to go to Cabinet before a White Paper is drafted? Then once the White Paper is released for public comment what happens then. How long do people have to submit input and then what?
Journalist: To Minister Motshekga there was a call from the Equal Education Campaign for you to take over the administration of the Eastern Cape Education Department and to immediately reinstate the scholar transport and school nutrition programme. Are you thinking of this and if you are not what are you going to do to make sure pupils are fed and transported. Thanks.
Journalist: To Minister Motshekga three quick questions. Firstly on the TTT issue which you correctly placed central for education. How is it going to be monitored and how will those who do not conform to that be sanctioned? Secondly on the matric exams, UMALUSI did a statisticalanalysis of it all and your department has been strong in saying that these people are independent. Have you had a look at their statistical analysis and do you personally agree that the markets were correctly tabulated. Finally on the Annual National Assessment is there any international benchmarking or is this going to be a completely domestic exercise.
Journalist: My question is to Minister Motshekga the R4.9 billion to eradicate mud schools in the Eastern Cape, who will manage that money. Is it you or is it the department in the Eastern Cape. Just for clarity is the money for the upcoming financial year or is it for the period leading up to 2014. When will the same be done with other provinces where the similar problem occurs. Mpumalanga and Limpopo. Thank you.
Minister Aaron Motsoaledi: The process of National Health Insurance (NHI) just to remind people the first policy document went to the Ministerial Committee a year ago and three issues were queried by the Inter-Ministerial Committee. One was the issue of primary healthcare that NHI is going to be based on the primary healthcare which I have outlined here and they were worried that it is not evident in the document what the plan is.
We had the whole year of working on the details of that the second issue that the committee queried was the issue of the cost of NHI which was a wild debate in the whole country and they were saying it is not very clear in the document. We have had the whole year of working on that and that was clarified. The last one was the economic benefits of NHI.
All these issues were clarified and only last week the Inter-Ministerial Committee said under the chairperson ship of the Minister of Finance and they looked into the document and they were satisfied and they passed it. We are in the process of preparing it for the next nearest Cabinet that will sit if it is approved there then it will go for public participation a process that in terms of the law as I understand will take three months. And from public participation it is back to Cabinet then to Parliament to be passed as an Act so that is the process
The second process that is happening silently away from the public is the preparations within the Department many people when they think about NHI they just think about the policy document that it is all they want to see. The preparation of health institutions the auditing of human resources of what is there and the issue of equipment that is ongoing and with due course we will be able to unveil that because that work is being going on for the past 12 months. All the other questions were not mine.
Minister Angie Motshekga: The Eastern Cape one, already two weeks back we have already started working on the Eastern Cape and I think the call by Equal Education comes at a point where we have already started the process as the department because when we are doing our ten days assessment we did pick up that there are serious problems in the Eastern Cape which I think was widely reported in the media. Transport, school nutrition, Learning and Teaching Support Materials(LTSM) and the ongoing problem of infrastructure. We have to monitor the ten days to say do kids have a book in front of them, every child must have a book for every subject so we did get reports that indeed that was not on. I am meeting MEC's the coming Friday we have developed a tool to assess what the gaps are in terms of your learner resource provision. So through that tool we will then be able to top up from the savings that we made from the work books we will pay 75% and provinces are expected to pay 25% to top up on where the gaps are. So we have developed a tool and the process is ongoing.
On time it is a big one, does teachers and time teaching so we are looking at different processes. One we are focusing on areas where we are quite aware that there isn't much happening so NIDO has been helping us to monitor and really say what the problem is and they have visited a number of areas. We are also activating our school governing bodies (SGBs) because my view is that if parents that simple campaign that Congress of South African Trade Unions (Cosatu) wants to take of just helping schools with late coming. So as much as they catch children they will catch teachers who are arriving late. So we will wait for the children and guide them but we know we will catch teachers.
So we are working on community support to make sure that indeed we can begin to monitor schools because we can' t be there everyday. We will send officials but officials can't be in the 29 000 schools everyday but community people can be in schools everyday and that is what we are using as part of complementing the teaching time just to be there on time. Again through monitoring of class work, class visits we will be able to monitor if indeed there is any progress taking place in class if teachers are teaching because they could be there at school everyday but no teaching effectively.
So we are using different tools at our disposal to make sure that indeed we can monitor if there is effective teaching in our classrooms. More important also we have tabled a document before the unions of keeping on the accountability of principals so we are starting with principals and then go to Heads of Departments because the principal are suppose to be there everyday. So if he is a manager his managing effectively his using the necessary tools you don't even need anybody outside.
Our structure of education is quite extensive it is not like before when you only had the principal and the deputy principal there are Heads of Departments. We are also suppose to be monitoring progress if there is teaching if there's effective teaching, if they are there everyday, they are there for seven days there should be monitoring. Then we are also working on documents to make sure that we hold them accountable because they are there everyday there is no amount of inspectorate that can be there five days a week, seven hours a day. The school has to be properly managed inside and that is why we are looking at strengthening schools to make sure that they work.
We are looking also on supporting our teachers through training on effective teaching because they could be there but sometimes there is no effective teaching. So the time issue also talks about classroom practise and we are looking at mainly only using ICT's to make sure that there is effective teaching so that when you are using the time it is used effectively and efficiently. That is why we are on a major drive on your resourcing of schools but also using ICT's that enables us in supporting of classroom practices.
On teachers again we will be announcing, we will be launching our teacher development framework in March now, we have been doing lots of work since the summit and again we will be talking about the developmental plans that we have for our teachers, the training programmes but other issues that relates to teaching in terms of their well-being, in terms of their development but also in terms of a productive relationship with them. We are working very hard on our relationships with them they were fractured last year after the fallout and both the Department and the teacher unions are working very hard to make sure that indeed there is a healthy working relationship between us and them and make sure we can really deal with any problems that we have in good time and make sure that it does not affect schools.
On UMALUSI and analysis it is true that they are independent and I can assure that when I was first appointed as Minister in 2009, I went through a briefing where they tell you this is UMALUSI, this is how it works this is how it does its analysis. So I am familiar with the tools and this is how it has done the whole thing more than donkey years back. This is how exams are being monitored internationally, you know I was even saying to some of the journalists that even themselves their marks were adjusted it is a normal practise. I taught at the university that you don't release results even at the university without sitting down to look at the trends and really be able to say, even grade one marks you sit with a schedule of marks for grade one and analyse and say do we think the trends are right, could there have been anything wrong, do you think that perhaps this paper was unfairly difficult.
Why do all the kids even the ones who get A in maths are getting a D or an F in science it means there was something wrong with the science paper because this thing does not make sense. So there are trends which tell you if things did not go well. So the whole process of moderating marks is an educational process it is not an UMALUSI process it is an educational process on how you deal with promotions and it is part of how you manage promotions. UMALUSI has fortunately they have a very scientific process which is really done by statisticians it is a process that me as an ordinary teacher can really be told to say this what statisticians are saying it is not done by ordinary people.
So really it is a scientific tool that they are using or they have been using so on that I mean I have no doubt around their credibility of what processes they get into because it is a scientific tool and I have no reason to doubt it. Even in 2009 when I dropped, I didn't cry foul and say I'm just a new Minister it is not good for my name please do something for me just to keep my job. I could have said if it was possible because it was quite hurting to get into a post and then you have a dip. So I did not interfere even in this instance there was no reason to interfere accept for being hopeful which I said the rise gave us hope and we welcome it. So UMALUSI is indeed independent and we are not able to influence them and I am sure also for their own integrity it is highly skilled professionals from universities who didn't want to compromise their names out of a Minister perhaps desperate to keep a job, they would not be able to do that for their own integrity.
The Annual National Assessments has been internationally benchmarked because we really are preparing ourselves back for those international teams which are the ones which did reflect that we are experiencing problems. So they are national in a sense that everyone is writing them but the main thing is that you are benchmarking them internationally because that is what we think will be a way of improving our marks. We don't claim that they are a 100% perfect but we have had experts to help us develop those assessment tools and do hope that indeed they will be able to give us a true reflection on the skills of South African kids even at an international level.
The R4.9 billion is going to be managed by DPE, Treasury mainly but also with the involvement of provinces in terms of data and information because we don't want to build schools in the wrong places but also don't want to build schools for instance if we do any renovations. We renovate a school for instance in a part of Gauteng a school which is on line for closure so we have to work very close with schools to make sure that indeed the schools that we plan to renovate are schools that still have a long term in terms of their own assessment.
Only 60% of the money is going to go to the Eastern Cape, other provinces also still have inappropriate structures so we will be looking, for instance KZN they still have inappropriate infrastructures, Limpopo and Mpumalanga. So 60% of the money is going to the Eastern Cape and 40% is going to be shared by the other eight provinces in terms of inappropriate structures. So it will be your mud schools, tin, wooden schools and your asbestos schools. So the money is going to be managed by us it is R8 billion for the term but annually Government sends to provinces R17 billion for infrastructure.
So even that money although we won't control it we are going to monitor those provinces because we are quite aware in some instances money meant for classrooms is used to build for fences. Fences are critical but classrooms are more of a priority. Monies which are meant to build ablution systems are used to hire toilets, we want them to build toilets and not to hire them because they are also very unhealthy. So we will be monitoring them and managing them but the short answer is that the R4.9 billion that the President announced we are going to start spending R500 million this year so it is R8 billion over a period of time.
The outstanding money is going to be used for planning to role out next year so what we definitely know that we will be able to spend this year it is R800 million. We have been given R8 billion for three years, so it is to start planning to spend it for next year so that we can start rolling in 2012 and in 2013 then we can be able to finish the other outstanding money. So it is strictly meant for inappropriate structures and it is going to be shared nationally with the bulk going to Eastern Cape because theyhave the most inappropriate structures. Thanks.
Journalist: My question is to doctor Motsoaledi it is in fact three short ones. I just want to know in terms of the MDG's we did very poorly last year on the maternal and child mortality rates and the doctor told the portfolio committee that the department will now look into how to measure indicators itself. I was wondering if you could explain if there is any progress on that the measurement within the department to improve on the Millenium Development Goals (MDGs). Then in terms of the HCT Campaign you say we have reached six million people and six million more to reach but the problem is that the six million reached already need to be continuously reached. I want to know what in your campaign targets retesting. In terms of PMTCT in the statement we got now from you, you talk about it as a preventative measure but it is a wish. It is stated as wish and I was hoping that you could give us more information as to how you are targeting PMTCT. Thanks.
Journalist: I have questions for the Health and Education Minister but I think I will go to sport because I think the Deputy Sports Minister is feeling a bit neglected. Mr Oosthuizen I wonder if you could give us some insight into why after 17 years we are still trying to get school sport under way?
Journalist: On page five there is reference to consolidating all sources of bursary and loans under the banner of the National Student Financial Aid Scheme. For clarity sake are you looking at private funding of bursaries or is this merely the state funding that is going to be consolidated.
Journalist: On page five there is reference to consolidating all sorts of bursary and loans under the banner of the National Student Financial Aid Scheme, its the fourth paragraph from the top. I just want for clarity's sake to ask are also looking at private funding of bursaries or is this nearly the State funding that will be consolidated?
Journalist: It appears that a number of universities and also the National Student Financial Aid Fund simply decline any first year student, any kind of financial assistance or bursaries. Now that seems to stand in quite a contrast to various initiatives to make more money and more financial aid available. Feedback from the University of Technologies as well is that first year students simply do not have access to any sort of financial assistance and bursaries.
Journalist: There has been some discussion about we know that we need the artisans. There has been some attention paid to the fact that the FET training is pitched at a matric or even a post matric level and we know from our own experience and we know that not every child going through school is intended for an academic path. The children who in theold days might have left schools at lets say Standard 7 or 8 and would have gone into the whole apprenticeship training scheme. How do we cater for that potential?
The first question about Millennium Development Goals (MDGs). Yes as a country as I have said in the statement we are not doing well on both maternal and child mortality. We are working on that, that is why it is one of the outcomes we have signed with the President and we are preparing everyday to try and compart that because it is not a good thing. But what the DG meant about data collection was that our figure of maternal mortality we think placed extraordinary hight, it is unacceptably high but not, we don't believe it is as high as the figure that is being given to us of about 600 deaths per 100 000 people.
Now the infant or child mortality we believe is accurate, because of this we have established and part of this problem is data collection especially in far rural hospitals and the fact that quite a number f people might still be delivering at home. So for that reason we have established a Data Advisory Committee that involves top researchers in this field, demographers and experts.
They are working with Stats South Africa to try and review this maternal fatality figure because it is Stats South Africa that came with the figure. So that we release a figure that is acceptable to Stats South Africa, to researchers, to demographers and to our universities, that work is ongoing. But the work of comparting maternal and child mortality that one we are not questioning, it is ongoing, we don't accept what is happening in the country.
The issue 86 million people who have tested I think it is a good question. Because we are trying to tell people because they believe we are chasing figures, they believe we are chasing a figure of 15 million and that is the end and we close. It cant help the country, we chose that figure because we want during that period up to June, we want sustained discussion and mobilisation so that people must get used to testing. At the end of that period we want them to continue testing that is why we are insisting that every health facility must be able to provide this service.
You must be able to move from the street and get into every health facility and say please test me, and we want people to test as many times as possible. If the figure of 50 million is exceeded to 60 meaning that people have repeated its ok. Yesterday at Wits there is a student who appeared on TV and said I am going to test every three months, and people thought he is mad. That is exactly what we are encouraging, he has tested once, he must repeat it every three months to make sure that he is still safe, and that will encourage them. Where will he go now that he knows there is this service, it was established yesterday formally at Wits.
Tat team which is there will not stay at Wits forever they will go away after one month. What then happens, but the student would have known that there us a service like this and would have been told that you can go to the nearest hospital please keep on. And I am also encouraging you here. By the way how many journalists have tested? You know we never took this campaign to the journalist sector and here in Parliament I am busy discussing with all the Chief Whips who want to bring it here at the City of Parliament. Every South African must know their status and do it again and again for the next 20 to 30 years by the way.
The issue of PMTCT. I was just expressing my wish is not there is nothing practised. You know I will be the happiest person n earth if one day when I wake up I find that every singe woman who is pregnant has tested and if positive they go on PMTCT. The reason that I mentioned in the statement as a wish is as I am sitting here we have got the program is on but it depends on the women who are pregnant to come to our health centres, I don't know who is pregnant as I am sitting here, out there in the villages and I don't know who are at 14 weeks, that is the weakness of this system. That is why when we put primary healthcare teams we are going to ask them to concentrate on this because it is something that is winnable. 70 000 children born HIV positive, there is a method to stop that from happening and we can find that we reduce the figure to zero or even in our outcomes to five percent.
It will be the happiest day of our country but will the pregnant women come or will they come at the time of delivery like many of them do when it is already too late. Because if a woman is at term and you start PMTCT the chance of stopping the HIV from from going to that child is very slim. The Director of the Global Fund, Professor Mitchell Kazatchkine was reminding me, he is French you know.
He was reminding me that in his country by 2009 only four women transmitted HIV and AIDS to their children, four in that while country. And he was reminding me that in Africa there were 400 000 who transmitted HIV to their children and 70 000 of them come from South Africa. He was saying you can do what the French is doing by making sure that each one of them get tested and treated so that even if the mother is positive there is no reason for the child to be positive as well.
Deputy Minister Gert Oosthuizen: Let the Ministers finish first please, I will be last.
Minister Blade Nzimande: It doesn't matter either Bafana Bafana is doing well or not so it doesn't mater. You know maybe let me just start with you permission very briefly by underlining what Minister Motshekga said earlier about this issue of UMALUSI. I think that media should be helping to partner with us as Government for these kinds of services that we are trying to offer to people. Because sometimes I was wondering whether this thing of asking anybody who has done moderation to expose reasons for its criteria, is it out of ignorance or malice? Because nowhere else in the world is this done, principles are published but for the purposes of protecting the integrity of the system, we possibly will be the only country which will start doing that across the board.
As the Minister was saying from Grade 1 right up to University including panels that discuss PHD programs and exams. Nowhere else are we actually, we are being asked to do something that is not being done anywhere else in the word as far as I am aware and its normal standard practise to protect rather than to undermine the education system. I challenge you Jan Jan lets do research together and you tell me where a panel which has done this comes out and gives you details other than just principles. That is why I am asking the question with a plea, let the media be our partners and if it out of ignorance we are happy to provide information and I hope it is not malice. I think it is a very important point to make, I am not now introducing something else into this press briefing. Results are good, results are bad Government is doing bad, results are good no they cant be, they must be manipulated, there is a problem. I will be repeating this in Parliament this afternoon, sorry Chair.
The issue of bursaries. Our aim really is to have a better picture of bursaries in South Africa. It would be good if this bursary allocation was located in one institution but it is not necessary., When we are taking consolidation we are talking about. For instance there is a situation where we do not normally know, National Student Financial Aid Scheme (NSFAS) offers bursaries but Sector Education and Training Authorities (SETAs) also offer bursaries, Maybe it is a good thin that they d. But we need to have a better sense so that we have got better synergies and we have got maximum impact. Municipalities also offer university or college bursary, we would like to have information about all these even from the private sector so that we are better able. For instance at the moment we are collecting data abut oversees bursaries that are offered to South Africans because we may be able to use them better if we have that information. The second question I am not so sure about the information that you are bringing that first year students are being declined access if they are not paying.
The rule simply is this all poor students who meet the academic criteria as well as the means tests and family income of more than a R122 000 per annum, they are being assisted. We have even waved this requirement of an upfront registration fees for National Student Financial Aid Scheme (NSFAS) beneficiary because that acted as exclusion. You say a student is poor but you want R3 000 or R4 000 and I would like to plead with the media that if they pick up these things that they are actually happening, please bring them to our attention. Because it means some institutions are actually undermining Government policy.
Yes we accept that not al the students will get the full cost of study that is why as a start as the President announced we are starting with final years to say we will get a loan equivalent of full cost of study and transfer it into a full bursary if you pass. On the last issue, look we are actually at the moment undertaking huge initiatives on artisan training, this is at the centre of Government's skills development strategy.
Very quickly or let me start with the issue of this repeat that you are talking about. This is one we are trying to deal with now because your national certificate vocational at FET college in terms of the National Qualification Framework is equivalent to Grades 10, 11 and 12. So you find students who write matric they don't pass they go and do the National Certificate Vocational (NCV) which means basically they start from Grade 10, 11, which means that they actually do an equivalent of matric for six years, that is a waste of money and waste of our youth's talent.
We are looking into that now because we want to sort out this year so that when we begin next year we have got a different way of actually tacking this particular problem. For instance we are looking at what one would call a post matric NCV which may not be three years or something like that depending on what the students have done. Now on artisan training we are undertaking fairly major initiatives, for instance we have established what is called the National Artisan Moderating Body who's aim is just to set minimum standards for artisan training in this country. We estimate that there are more than a 100 different artisan programmes in this country many of whom or some of whom to play it safe are frankly fly by night.
So we want to create common minimum standards for artisan training so that we are able to produce the kinds of artisans that we need as a country. We are also building the capacity of the further education and training (FET) colleges to be able to train artisans, we are not starting from scratch Government has been doing this but we are in a better position now with the Department of Education and Training bringing together your SETAS and your FET colleges to be able to do better. And lastly the other matter that relates to this is the relationship between FET qualifications and entrance to university or articulation with university. This is all part of a package of the training of artisans and technicians in our country.
Deputy Minister Gert Oosthuizen: I think I speak with my counterpart sitting here, in fact the Minister of Basic Education is better positioned as a Minister as our partner in school sport with the Deputy Minister to answer the question. The acknowledgement of the importance of sport at school and also physical education has been acknowledged long ago. In 2005 we signed a collaborative agreement. It is not as if there were no activities taking place but it was merely for the children whose parents could afford to do that and the schools because of the sad history we have in this country some schools are well endowed with facilities others don't have facilities. We have just listened here to mud schools and a budget of R4.9 billion going to just address mud schools. So it speaks to resources, we have the full support, the two departments are focussed, there is agreement on what needs to be done.
We have come a long way since 2005 since that collaborative agreement was signed, I think the bottlenecks are now being addressed. The aim is really to massify the schools sport and to ensure that we have physical activity at schools, our understanding is that is happening and that we have focused school sport in the afternoon and hopefully create an active and a winning nation. And by doing so unearthing all the talent the full pool of resources and talent that we have in our country so that the child irrespective of where they are, irrespective of their financial position can excel to the highest sporting sport in this country.
I am convinced that we will see once Minister we have achieved what we have set out to achieve and announce towards the end of March this year how we will address the one or two bottlenecks we still face with the full support of our partners we will see in 18 months time the difference already in society. So to answer your question it has never been a question of not wanting rub it out it was a question of advocacy, of ensuring that we massify school sport and take it to the rural areas in the schools that don't have facilities and we have to ensure that is our challenge that there is a shared base of facilities in the vicinity. So it is going to be a hard challenge but one we will be looking forwardto.
